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The beginning of the Tribulations
07-04-2009, 10:57 AM (This post was last modified: 07-04-2009 10:58 AM by Elijah_101.)
Post: #1
The beginning of the Tribulations
When you see Jerusalem compassed with armies, This is the very beginning
of the tribulations Matt 24:16-21 Israel will be Destroyed Zech 14:1-5 Luke 21:24 Isaiah 5:26-30 Hab 1:7-9 Isaiah 13:15-18

This is when the time of the Gentiles be fulfilled. Luke 21:24

Then shall the Lord go forth, and fight against those nations, as when he fought in the day of battle. 4 And his feet shall stand in that day upon the mount of Olives, which is before Jerusalem on the east, and the mount of Olives shall cleave in the midst thereof toward the east and toward the west, and there shall be a very great valley; and half of the mountain shall remove toward the north, and half of it toward the south.

The thing most people are not understanding is the church Jesus is talking about is some were in Israel, as the Scripture says Below

This generation shall not pass away, till all be fulfilled. Luke 21:32

And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh. Luke 21:20

But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains Mark 13:14

then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains: And let him that is on the housetop not go down into the house, neither enter therein, to take any thing out of his house: And let him that is in the field not turn back again for to take up his garment. Mark 13:14-16

Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto. Luke 21:21

In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back. Remember Lot's wife.

But his wife looked back from behind him, and she became a pillar of salt. Gen 19:26



Now who are these People fleeing to the wilderness?


The woman fled into the wilderness

And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days. Rev 12:6

a thousand two hundred and threescore days 3 1/2 years, is how long the tribulation will last Rev 12:6 Dan 12:11-13

Now who is the Women? the Church[color]

And ye shall flee to the valley of the mountains; for the valley of the mountains shall reach unto Azal: yea, ye shall flee, like as ye fled from before the earthquake in the days of Uzziah king of Judah: and the Lord my God shall come, and all the saints with thee. Zech 14:1-5

This is when satan will be cast down, and go after the Church

Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them.

Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time.

And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child. Rev 12:12-13

And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ. Rev 12:17


Zeph 1:14-18 - The great day of the LORD is near, it is near, and hasteth greatly, even the voice of the day of the LORD: the mighty man shall cry there bitterly.

That day is a day of wrath, a day of trouble and distress, a day of wasteness and desolation, a day of darkness and gloominess, a day of clouds and thick darkness,

A day of the trumpet and alarm against the fenced cities, and against the high towers.

And I will bring distress upon men, that they shall walk like blind men, because they have sinned against the LORD: and their blood shall be poured out as dust, and their flesh as the dung.

Neither their silver nor their gold shall be able to deliver them in the day of the LORD'S wrath; but the whole land shall be devoured by the fire of his jealousy: for he shall make even a speedy riddance of all them that dwell in the land.

Isaiah 13:6-8 - Howl ye; for the day of the LORD is at hand; it shall come as a destruction from the Almighty. 7 Therefore shall all hands be faint, and every man's heart shall melt: 8 And they shall be afraid: pangs and sorrows shall take hold of them; they shall be in pain as a woman that travaileth: they shall be amazed one at another; their faces shall be as flames.

Isaiah 13:9 - Behold, the day of the LORD cometh, cruel both with wrath and fierce anger, to lay the land desolate: and he shall destroy the [/color][/u][/i]
thereof out of it. [i][u]

Isaiah 66:16 For by fire and by his sword will the LORD plead with all flesh: and the slain of the LORD shall be many.


Jer 25:33 And the slain of the LORD shall be at that day from one end of the earth even unto the other end of the earth: they shall not be lamented, neither gathered, nor buried; they shall be dung upon the ground.

Isaiah 34:4 - Their slain also shall be cast out, and their stink shall come up out of their carcases, and the mountains shall be melted with their blood. 4 And all the host of heaven shall be dissolved, and the heavens shall be rolled together as a scroll


Jer 16:4 - They shall die of grievous deaths; they shall not be lamented; neither shall they be buried; but they shall be as dung upon the face of the earth: and they shall be consumed by the sword, and by famine; and their carcases shall be meat for the fowls of heaven, and for the beasts of the earth.
And to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, even Jesus, which delivered us from the wrath to come.1 Thess 1:10

Because the Elect obey God and Keep his commandments words and sayings John 14:14-23 John 8:43

The Sheep Obey God and Keep His Commandments words and Sayings as Jesus said My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me John 10:26 Rev 7:3 Saying, Hurt not the earth, neither the sea, nor the trees, till we have sealed the servants of our God in their foreheads.

The Goats are sinners, which will be taken and destroyed Then shall he say also unto them on the left hand, Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angelsMatthew 25:31-45

The Wrath of God is for those who do not Obey Gods commandments words and sayings JOhn 14:15-23 John 8:53 Romans 1:18

Because thou hast kept the word of my patience, I also will keep thee from the hour of temptation, which shall come upon all the world, to try them that dwell upon the earth. Rev 3:10

Put ye in the sickle, for the harvest is ripe: come, get you down; for the press is full, the fats overflow; for their wickedness is great. Multitudes, multitudes in the valley of decision: for the day of the LORD is near in the valley of decision.

As the Scripture says

For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.

But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. 1 Thess 5:3-4

Those who see the Great Tribulations coming and keep the Commandments words and sayings of God will excape the the hour of temptation

We know that Jesus is not coming until after the tribulations Matt 24:29-30

The most well know Scripture for Rapture believers 1 Thess 4:14-15

For if we believe that Jesus died and rose again, even so them also which sleep in Jesus will God bring with him.

When Know when Jesus Died on the Cross he went to hell that day as the Scripture says in Jonah 2:1 Matt 12:40

By which also he went and preached unto the spirits in prison 1 Peter 3:19 (KJV)

That thou mayest say to the prisoners, Go forth; to them that are in darkness, Shew yourselves.


Wherefore he saith, When he ascended up on high, he led captivity captive, and gave gifts unto men. 9 (Now that he ascended, what is it but that he also descended first into the lower parts of the earth? Eph 4:8-9

To open the blind eyes, to bring out the prisoners from the prison, and them that sit in darkness out of the prison house. Isaiah 42:7

Jesus Took all of those that Believe In Him out of captivity And

Put them in another captivity ...Which They are... sleep in Jesus 1 Thess 4:14

Which The Scripture says in Rev 6:10-11

And they cried with a loud voice, saying, How long, O Lord, holy and true, dost thou not judge and avenge our blood on them that dwell on the earth?

And white robes were given unto every one of them; and it was said unto them, that they should rest yet for a little season, until their fellowservants also and their brethren, that should be killed as they were, should be fulfilled.

And shall not God avenge his own elect, which cry day and night unto him, though he bear long with them? 8 I tell you that he will avenge them speedily. Luke 18:7-8

These are the People Jesus will Bring with him, on his Return,

Now we must Remember, When is Jesus Coming, Immediately after the tribulation Matt 24:29-30

15 For this we say unto you by the word of the Lord, that we which are alive and remain unto the coming of the Lord shall not prevent them which are asleep.

For the Lord himself shall descend from heaven with a shout, with the voice of the archangel, and with the trump of God: and the dead in Christ shall rise first 1 Thess 4:16

Then we which are alive and remain shall be caught up together with them in the clouds, to meet the Lord in the air: and so shall we ever be with the Lord. 1 Thess 4:17

Now who are these that are Alive and Remain From What?

And I said unto him, Sir, thou knowest. And he said to me, These are they which came out of great tribulation , and have washed their robes, and made them white in the blood of the Lamb. Rev 7:13-14

This is when Jesus will Gather his ELECT After the TRIBULATIONS Matt 24:29-31

Now is Jesus takeing you to heaven, in that meeting in the Air? NO

Meeting The Lord In The Air

Lord cometh with ten thousands of his saints To execute judgment upon all Jude 1:14

All will Go through the Tribulations, no one will excape this Great dreadful day, which will be upon this earth soon, so Prepair your Self, Get Closer to God, repent from all Sins, and Pray you maybe able to Stand Before the Son of Man Luke 21:36

And except those days should be shortened, there should no flesh be saved: but for the elect's sake those days shall be shortened.
Matt 24:22
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07-04-2009, 07:05 PM
Post: #2
RE: The beginning of the Tribulations
It is an error in exegesis to replace Nation Israel with the Church, called Replacement Theology.

Romans 11:

25: For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness in part is happened to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.
26: And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:
27: For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.
28: As concerning the gospel, they are enemies for your sakes: but as touching the election, they are beloved for the fathers' sakes.
29: For the gifts and calling of God are without repentance.

The Church is neither the enemy of itself NOR is it the Church which brings forth the Man Child Who will rule all nations with a rod of iron:

Rev. 12:

1: And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
2: And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.
3: And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
4: And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.
5: And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.


The Woman and The Man-Child

Revelation 12: The Woman and the Man Child PDF Print E-mail
Written by J.R.Lawendowski
Monday, 20 August 2007 08:52

In Revelation chapter 12, we have one of the "paranthetical" chapters describing in detail the personages and events of the Tribulation. There is continual debate over the identities of the figures discussed. Again, remaining true to a literal format using Scripture to interpret Scripture we can easily identify the persons, places and events.

Proper identification is of course drawn from all of Scripture to include within the chapter itself.

Rev 12:1 And there appeared a great wonder in heaven; a woman clothed with the sun, and the moon under her feet, and upon her head a crown of twelve stars:
Rev 12:2 And she being with child cried, travailing in birth, and pained to be delivered.

The first clue in identifying the woman and who she represents can be found in v.5. In v.5 we see that the woman is bringing forth a man child who "was to rule all nations with a rod of iron". We know who this is that will rule with a rod of iron from the messianic prophecies (Ps 2:9; Rev 2:27; Rev 19:15). This man child in v.5 is none other than Jesus Christ. Now, since we know who the child of the woman is we also know who the woman is...Israel. If you look at Genesis 37:9-10 we see in a dream of Joseph imagery very similar to the imagery given here. In Genesis it represents the 12 tribes of Israel. Further, this verse in conjunction with v.17 points even further back to a messianic passage in Genesis...Gen 3:15. Further, in the OT Israel is figuratively described as a travailing woman ( Is 26;17-18; Jer 4:31; 13:21; Mic 4:10; 5:3).

Rev 12:3 And there appeared another wonder in heaven; and behold a great red dragon, having seven heads and ten horns, and seven crowns upon his heads.
Rev 12:4 And his tail drew the third part of the stars of heaven, and did cast them to the earth: and the dragon stood before the woman which was ready to be delivered, for to devour her child as soon as it was born.

We all know who the red dragon is, there is no secret there...we also know from this passage that when he fell from grace he took a third of the angels in heaven with him. Also from v.4 we know that from the time of Christ's birth satan was trying to take him out, first by Herod's decree to kill all the males (Matt 2:13), we also know that once Christ started His ministry satan tried to destroy Him by tempting Him...it all failed. It also provides some important imagery for further discussion regarding the 7 heads and 10 horns etc.

Rev 12:5 And she brought forth a man child, who was to rule all nations with a rod of iron: and her child was caught up unto God, and to his throne.

Again, see the discussion of v.1-2 for this, but the man child is Christ, NOT the church.

Rev 12:6 And the woman fled into the wilderness, where she hath a place prepared of God, that they should feed her there a thousand two hundred and threescore days.

This passage aligns nicely with the events Christ Himself talked about in Matt 24:15-16; Mark 13:14 confirming the events in Dan 9:27...at the abomination of desolation (at the midst of the week, 3.5 years into the Tribulation...with 3.5 years or 1260 days to go). At that point the remnant of Israel (a large portion of those in Jerusalem) will flee to the desert and God will protect them until Christ returns. We see David talking about this in Psalm 27.

Rev 12:7 And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels,
Rev 12:8 And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven.
Rev 12:9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
Rev 12:10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night.
Rev 12:11 And they overcame him by the blood of the Lamb, and by the word of their testimony; and they loved not their lives unto the death.

At this point in time...right now...as we speak...satan has access to the throne of God (Job 1:6-12; 2:1-7). He is the accuser (Rev 12:10). At some point, the Archangel Michael will stand up (Dan 12:1) for Israel, not the church, Israel. Some things of note here, some will try to identify the restrainer of 2 Thess 2 as Michael...but there are some issues with that identification, among them is that the restrainer is singular and the restrainer Himself withholds evil...something Michael cannot apparently do by himself as we see in this passage. It takes Michael and his angels to fight the dragon and his angels. The restrainer is more powerful than Michael alone.

Basically, at this point (about the middle of the Tribulation) Satan gets tossed out on his behind and no longer has access to heaven....the result? Rev 12:12-13.

Rev 12:12 Therefore rejoice, ye heavens, and ye that dwell in them. Woe to the inhabiters of the earth and of the sea! for the devil is come down unto you, having great wrath, because he knoweth that he hath but a short time. Rev 12:13 And when the dragon saw that he was cast unto the earth, he persecuted the woman which brought forth the man child.

This aligns with the description of the antichrist indwelt by satan for the second half of the Tribulation. He knows his time is short (3.5 years) and he's going to try his bast to wipe out not only the remnant of Israel but also the Tribulation Saints (Rev13:7).

Rev 12:14 And to the woman were given two wings of a great eagle, that she might fly into the wilderness, into her place, where she is nourished for a time, and times, and half a time, from the face of the serpent.
Rev 12:15 And the serpent cast out of his mouth water as a flood after the woman, that he might cause her to be carried away of the flood.
Rev 12:16 And the earth helped the woman, and the earth opened her mouth, and swallowed up the flood which the dragon cast out of his mouth.
Rev 12:17 And the dragon was wroth with the woman, and went to make war with the remnant of her seed, which keep the commandments of God, and have the testimony of Jesus Christ.

Finally we see the effect of satan's war against the protected remnant of Israel...it's fruitless. Taking this literally it seems that God will directly intervene to protect them not only as they flee to the desert (to the place prepared by God Rev 12:6 and also Ps 27) When that fails....the antichrist, indwelt by satan will turn his fury towards the remnant of Israel throughout the world (both physical Israel - the Jews - and spiritual Israel - those grafted in - the Tribulation Saints).

Sources:
1. J Dwight Pentecost, “Things to Come”
2. Edward Hindson & Mal Couch, "Revelation, Unlocking the Future"

A servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
15: But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
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07-04-2009, 07:27 PM
Post: #3
RE: The beginning of the Tribulations
Replacement Theology

Replacement theology teaches that the church is the replacement for Israel and that the many promises made to Israel in the Bible are fulfilled in the Christian church, not in Israel. So, the prophecies in Scripture concerning the blessing and restoration of Israel to the Promised Land are “spiritualized” or “allegorized” into promises of God's blessing for the church. Major problems exist with this view, such as the continuing existence of the Jewish people throughout the centuries and especially with the revival of the modern state of Israel. If Israel has been condemned by God, and there is no future for the Jewish nation, how do we explain the supernatural survival of the Jewish people over the past 2000 years despite the many attempts to destroy them? How do we explain why and how Israel reappeared as a nation in the 20th century after not existing for 1900 years?

The view that Israel and the church are different is clearly taught in the New Testament. Biblically speaking, the church is completely different and distinct from Israel, and the two are never to be confused or used interchangeably. We are taught from Scripture that the church is an entirely new creation that came into being on the day of Pentecost and will continue until it is taken to heaven at the rapture (Ephesians 1:9-11; 1 Thessalonians 4:13-17). The church has no relationship to the curses and blessings for Israel. The covenants, promises, and warnings are valid only for Israel. Israel has been temporarily set aside in God's program during these past 2000 years of dispersion.

After the rapture (1 Thessalonians 4:13-18), God will restore Israel as the primary focus of His plan. The first event at this time is the tribulation (Revelation chapters 6-19). The world will be judged for rejecting Christ, while Israel is prepared through the trials of the great tribulation for the second coming of the Messiah. Then, when Christ does return to the earth, at the end of the tribulation, Israel will be ready to receive Him. The remnant of Israel which survives the tribulation will be saved, and the Lord will establish His kingdom on this earth with Jerusalem as its capital. With Christ reigning as King, Israel will be the leading nation, and representatives from all nations will come to Jerusalem to honor and worship the King—Jesus Christ. The church will return with Christ and will reign with Him for a literal thousand years (Revelation 20:1-5).

Both the Old Testament and the New Testament support a premillennial/dispensational understanding of God's plan for Israel. Even so, the strongest support for premillennialism is found in the clear teaching of Revelation 20:1-7, where it says six times that Christ's kingdom will last 1000 years. After the tribulation the Lord will return and establish His kingdom with the nation of Israel, Christ will reign over the whole earth, and Israel will be the leader of the nations. The church will reign with Him for a literal thousand years. The church has not replaced Israel in God's plan. While God may be focusing His attention primarily on the church in this dispensation of grace, God has not forgotten Israel and will one day restore Israel to His intended role as the nation He has chosen (Romans 11).

A servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
15: But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
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07-04-2009, 07:39 PM
Post: #4
RE: The beginning of the Tribulations
Statement of Faith


# We believe in literal fulfillment of the prophecies and promises of the Scriptures which foretell and assure the future regeneration and restoration of Israel as a nation.

# We believe that all who receive by faith the Lord Jesus Christ are born again of the Holy Spirit and thereby become children of God.

# We believe in the bodily resurrection of the just and the Unjust, the everlasting blessedness of the saved, is coming again to take the church aout of the world, at which time the tribulation begins and will end at His coming to the earth to rule and reign for one thousand years as King if Kings and Lord of Lords.

# We believe We believe in the imminent, pre-Tribulation return of Jesus Christ for all believers. This Rapture of the saints will be followed by a seven year period of Tribulation, after which Christ will return in glory to judge the world and set up His millennial reign on earth.

A servant of Christ,
Drew

1 Tim. 3:
15: But if I tarry long, that thou mayest know how thou oughtest to behave thyself in the house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth.
16: And without controversy great is the mystery of godliness: God was manifest in the flesh, justified in the Spirit, seen of angels, preached unto the Gentiles, believed on in the world, received up into glory.
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